God Stopped Me from Leaving with Nicole Berlucchi of "Magnify Love"
“You’re going to stay in this marriage.” This was the message Nicole Berlucchi heard from God.
Before this, Nicole was convinced she was doing most of the work at home and in her marriage. Her friends told her she was a “saint” for putting up with her husband. To top it off, Nicole’s husband was unwilling to go to therapy.
Nicole was sure God was on her side.
Nicole left her husband for four days to discern if she was going to leave him. While Nicole entered this time of discernment relatively certain she was headed for divorce, God made it clear that Nicole needed to change and give her marriage a chance.
Nicole engaged in a very difficult season of healing that resulted in the transformation of her heart and marriage.
Listen to this mini-retreat in a podcast in Mamas in Spirit’s Lenten Series: HEAL. Allow God to help you remove barriers to love and be loved.
Nicole Berlucchi is the author of “Magnify Love: Unlocking the Heart of Jesus in Your Marriage and Your Life.”
Transcript:
Lindy Wynne (00:01.576)
Welcome to Mamas in Spirit, a podcast pointing you towards God in everything you are and everything you do. I'm Lindy Wynne and it is a blessing to be with you. It is always a gift to be with you. Welcome everyone to this Lenten series, the season seven, this year seven of Mamas in Spirit. In our Catholic faith, the number seven means completion. And I keep kind of thinking, does this mean that the
Podcast this mini retreat in a podcast comes to completion this year. I don't think so I don't know I take it year by year, but I don't think so I think that God is doing a work on my heart in my life and like that work is going to come to the completion this year But yet I'm so imperfect there's gonna be many more works of completion to be done in me as in all of us and I'm so blessed to be here and we are so blessed to be here for this mini retreat this time to take pause and
and really dig into how God has worked miracles in our lives. Share the witness and the testimony to the goodness of God with Nicole Berlucchi Nicole, thank you for joining us.
Nicole Berlucchi (01:07.351)
I'm so excited to be here. Thank you for having me.
Lindy Wynne (01:11.127)
Well, Nicole, you are just precious and we do not live far apart, everyone. And I had the gift of having coffee with Nicole. Gosh, it was probably over a year ago now. And you were working on this beautiful book, Magnify Love, which really magnifies love and the hope for us to magnify that love in our marriages. Yet if you are not married, do not turn away because every single podcast speaks to the soul. Really, that's really it. It's like I think of each story and each witness.
as the story of a soul. And that's what we all are. And that's how we want to see one another, like far beneath the layers of like what we see with a visible eye and go to the invisible, the goodness of the Lord and be that transparent. And so I thank you, Nicole, for being here. Because I know for all of us, it's always very vulnerable, but that's like the beauty of God. this is Lent. Think of Jesus in the garden. That was vulnerable. My goodness. That's like encapsulates vulnerability in and of itself. So in and of that Spirit
the Holy Spirit, Nicole, can you please open us in prayer?
Nicole Berlucchi (02:11.811)
Yes, I would love to in the name of the Father and of the Son and of Holy Spirit, Amen. Come Holy Spirit, come by the means of your most beloved spouse, our Blessed Virgin Mary.
Just ask you to open our hearts, Lord. We praise you today because you are so good. You heal and you restore in ways well beyond our imagination.
Lindy Wynne (02:38.765)
you
Nicole Berlucchi (02:39.767)
You break open hearts of stone so that they can love and receive love, both yours and love from others. I just ask you Lord to be with the listeners today. That if there is anything you need to say that they might hear it.
I hope that they feel hope from what we share today and what we discuss because you are so good.
Nicole Berlucchi (03:14.537)
We ask Mary's intercession, Hail Mary, full of grace, the Lord is with thee, blessed art thou amongst women and blessed is the fruit of thy womb, Jesus. Holy Mary, mother of God, pray for us sinners now at the hour of our death. Amen. In Jesus name we pray. Amen.
Lindy Wynne (03:30.367)
Amen. In the of the Father, Son, Holy Spirit, amen. Thank you for that beautiful prayer, Nicole, and
For your beautiful heart, I shared with Nicole before we started. like, I just loved going to coffee with you. There's just something so real and authentic and cozy. It's like when we all know we're in the presence of someone who is transparent. And I just love that, Nicole. That's a gift to me. And I'm so looking forward to hearing your story. So I'd love for you to start at the beginning.
Nicole Berlucchi (03:58.251)
Yeah, well, it's funny you mentioned the number seven because really what I want to share today was happening leading up to my seventh wedding anniversary. Joe and I, had gotten married. He's a great Catholic man. we checked all the boxes. It was like we just matched. He was from
eight kids, I was from six, like big Catholic family, very devout families. And we were just a great match right from the beginning. But as we got engaged and started into our marriage, I started to just doubt, you know, was Joe really ready to get married? And I went into my marriage thinking that in the back of my mind.
And it really impacted how I lived in my marriage. And so what ended up happening was I was really trying to earn Joe's love and just trying to do all the right things. then I was of course still like a very devout Catholic practicing, praying my rosary every day, my daily prayers. But it came to a head where I started becoming really resentful. Like I was like, I am working so hard in this marriage and
You're just he was in sales. So he was like out entertaining a lot which would lead to him sleeping in in the morning and I felt like I was really the responsible person in our marriage and he was just kind of along for the ride and At first I was like taking it as okay. He wasn't ready to get married to let me Let me just work really hard and be the right kind of wife and then he'll be like he'll be glad that he married me and keep in mind he never
voiced any kind of doubt like that to me, but it was just buried there in my heart, just this self doubt of whether he wanted to be married. And so as he kind of like, just was, know, kind of treading along in his career, I got offered a pretty big job opportunity, which would elevate me to be like the breadwinner in the family. And I took it. And this was after a long struggle with infertility, which also
Nicole Berlucchi (06:18.113)
very much impacted the intimacy in our marriage, made things really difficult. And so I took this job and I ended up getting pregnant about three months into the job without any fertility help. And so it was a big surprise and I was like, God, I thought I discerned about this job, you know, what's going on here. And so I really feel it was all part of his plan because what ended up happening was,
Joe continued how he was and then I was working so hard. I was traveling. I knew I couldn't continue my job because I was now gonna have a baby so I wasn't gonna be able to travel. So I had to have that discussion with my boss and I started to express to Joe, I am not happy. This is not going well. I don't know where you are. You're just kind of doing your own thing. I'm doing everything around the house. I just started just kind of like.
Catapulting all these things that I was doing and even like our friends would come over sometimes and they'd be like Oh Nicole you're such a saint for dealing with Joe and I'd be like that's right You know, like I am such a see Do you hear them? So anyway, so, know things kept coming to a head and I just Started asking him to go to counseling and he was like absolutely not like counseling is failure and then he You know, and I was like I just I don't know
if I can continue. And I think he wasn't really taking me seriously. And I, know, and at one point he said divorce is failure too. So he didn't clearly didn't want to divorce me, but he didn't want to go to counseling, which was a problem on my end. And so then he had this one night where, or actually it was a day, it was a day game for a baseball game. And that's when things came to head. He had gone out with customers and friends was out like for
solid 12 hours and mind you this I found out later, but it was on August 8th, which was the feast of st. Dominic and so the rosary I really believe played a an important part in kind of slowing down my heart and opening my heart and so He came home at midnight that night in the following morning. I was like, I'm leaving and I wasn't leaving like But I was pretty sure that I was going to leave him permanently. It was just more like I need to get away
Lindy Wynne (08:35.881)
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Nicole Berlucchi (08:43.745)
I'm extremely angry right now. You have shut me out, shut me down. You will not go to counseling and I need to leave. And so it was very kind of, I mean, I really believe it was Holy Spirit led because if I would have stayed, things would have been, I think really just full of tension. But I left the house like not, I did not have a plan. Like I didn't know I was going to go. I was just like, okay, I am here.
Lindy Wynne (09:07.581)
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Nicole Berlucchi (09:13.123)
And now I'm in my car with my backpack and where am I going to go? And it was like, and I just started saying like, come Holy Spirit, because I knew, I knew I needed to be really clear about what I was going to do. And I needed to be in a place where someone wasn't driving me to get divorced and someone wasn't driving me to stay in my marriage. And so I was like, who do I call? Like, who can I call right now?
So I texted two friends and I just let them know what was going on. was two wives of Joe's really good friends. And so like both of us had strong ties to those couples. I just said, this is the situation. I don't know where I'm going. I'll keep you guys posted. And so they were like, yes, please, know, whatever we can do. And then I drove down to actually the church we were married at. Father Philip Bochanski, his name is.
He was just like a great priest friend of ours. And so I just went there because I was like, I don't know where to go. And I feel like he's someone that I can talk to. So I show up on his doorstep. I'm hysterically crying. It was probably like 730 in the morning, seven o'clock in the morning. And he was like, whoa, what's going on? I try to tell him. then he's like, well, I have to go see a mass. There's a cloister, sisters across the street from them. He's like, I have to go.
Lindy Wynne (10:34.448)
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Nicole Berlucchi (10:38.827)
you've, why don't you come to mass? And so I went over and, and then I ended up leaving during mass. just like got so angry. The response that day was like about like the hearts of stone. And so I was just like, Lord, no, like this, this is not what I want to hear right now. And so I left and I was driving, trying to still trying to figure out where I was going to go. I wasn't really sure where I was going to spend the night. And father Phil calls me.
And he's like, Nicole, I'm here with Joe and I want you to, I'm wondering if you'll come back and talk to him. And like, I'm getting a little bit emotional still remembering this, but so it's like, okay. But I was still so angry. So I go back and Joe and I are at this long table and sitting pretty much at opposite ends of Father Phil's in the middle. And it was really good because I got to voice a lot.
of the doubts that I had carried for so many years about questions I had about his, just what he felt towards me and how he felt about me. And then Joe too got to just express remorse and obviously like just not having listened. And he felt really bad about that. And so after our conversation,
I said, I'm still going to leave. still like this, I need to sort out what I'm feeling. And so I ended up booking a hotel. The Jersey shore is not far from where we live. And so I booked a hotel down there because I always feel close to God, you know, the ocean. And, um, and so, uh, just spent, I spent four days there, I guess. And so the two women that I had called, they ended up coming down and spending the night with me.
And just we're supportive. They're like, whatever, whatever you guys decide, whatever happens, we're just here. Like we're here to love you both. And so they were so good. And when they, so that was the first night and they left. And I said, I really do think that we're probably going to get divorced, but they get, know, who knows? And so, so here I am like pregnant, so emotional, the Jersey shore, which was like,
Nicole Berlucchi (13:06.433)
It was August, so was like bustling with people. I can't even imagine people that saw me like walking the boardwalk and sitting out on my little patio thing, what they were thinking. I was reading, so I had several like spiritual books that I was reading at the time. of course was going, I went to daily mass, I was praying my rosary. And the thing that came up in my spiritual reading, I still remember really clearly was like, just the question of like, why are we here?
And like, what are you trying to do? Like with your life that is for you versus for God. And that's when things just started to, open up for me where I started to recognize, that in trying to be the best wife, the perfect wife for my husband, I hadn't really loved him well.
and really of shaming him. Not like intentionally, obviously like there was, I had goodness in mind, right? Like I thought it was doing the right thing. But when you're in a situation where you're in a relationship and the person who's, there's this person that's doing everything right, like doing all the, you know, harder things or whatever, like how do you...
Lindy Wynne (14:26.374)
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Nicole Berlucchi (14:34.047)
how do you kind of meet those expectations or how do you compete with that? Like not that my husband would be competing with me, but it's just more like, just trying to figure out, how do you be in a relationship and bring something to the table when they're bringing everything to the table? Right. So, it was a really hard truth to swallow. and God was basically like, you're going to stay in this marriage.
And it was so hard, like, because I always swore I would never be the woman that was walked all over and taken advantage of. But the reality was that...
Lindy Wynne (15:06.214)
you
Nicole Berlucchi (15:21.185)
that I needed to change and I had to give my marriage a chance to do that. And I think that the Lord also revealed that in my changing, Joe would change too. And that's exactly what happened. And yeah, and so we started, like I went back and we started counseling both privately and then together.
and our counselor was phenomenal. Like she just really understood what our faith meant in our marriage and how that drove decision-making. So she was very respectful of that. She was Jewish actually, but just had a deep respect for kind of that we were grounded in that place. And then she just really helped us unpack things from our childhood and then things that we had just not.
shared together, did not communicate well. mean, that became very clear in counseling. And yeah, and so then we just started this beautiful road to healing. We ended up renewing our wedding vows. So this happened in August. We renewed our wedding vows on our seventh anniversary. And so, you know, we had our two older kids there and then our third, you know, I was pregnant with and it was...
renewing your wedding vows. I don't know if you've done that since you've been married, but it is when you have gone through the year that we had gone through and like that moment and to be standing in front of Jesus and it was father Phil who renewed them for us. And I mean, I was bawling and to say those words, you know, for better or for worse. I just, yeah, it was just so.
Lindy Wynne (16:55.093)
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Nicole Berlucchi (17:13.987)
incredible. And so I just wanted, I don't know how much longer I should go on, but I just want to go, I want to tell a real consolation that God gave us because it was just so, it was like the exclamation point on him saying like, I have got this. So in October, so this is just again, like a month later, they announced John Paul II was being canonized and Joe calls me at work.
Lindy Wynne (17:19.621)
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Nicole Berlucchi (17:44.339)
And it's like, hey, they just announced JP2 is getting canonized. You want to go? And I was like, what? That's not something Joe would normally plan. But I knew it was for me. So I was like, yeah, of course I want to go. Let's book the trip. So we did. And our daughter, Annie, she was born in December on the Feast of Our Lady of Guadalupe. She came with us. She was four months old. And so we ended up
Lindy Wynne (17:51.228)
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Nicole Berlucchi (18:14.061)
We didn't have tickets. And Joe, being who he is, like Mr. Social, sales guy, ends up convinced, like he's talking, like working all the staff, like, come on, like she needs to sit down, she has a baby, blah, blah, blah. And so this one staff member takes pity on us basically and gives us, slips us two tickets, it's like here. And we go in, we're seated.
Lindy Wynne (18:20.933)
you
Nicole Berlucchi (18:42.761)
in the midst of all the priests. Like we are literally the section off the steps. So here we are, the two ladies in the sea of priests with our baby. There's two popes were being canonized. So was JP two and John Paul the 23rd, right? And, and then Pope Benedict and Pope Francis are both at the mass. And
Lindy Wynne (18:47.108)
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Nicole Berlucchi (19:09.197)
during the consecration, the sun comes out. was like a very cloudy day. The sun comes out. And then after mass, I had to step back because I had to feed Annie. And so I felt uncomfortable doing that in the priest. So I went to the very last row and I'm sitting there and the mass ends and everyone's like kind of pushing towards me. And I was like, what is going on? So the usher is like, are you all done? He's like, get up. Pope Francis is going to come right by here. Hold up the baby. She'll get blessed. And so,
Lindy Wynne (19:15.332)
you
Nicole Berlucchi (19:38.529)
So I did that, I'm holding her up and there's these young adult volunteers were screaming, Bambina, Bambina. And Pope Francis turned and blessed Annie and it was just like, I was just like, God, you are so good. Like here we are in this beautiful city of ours, know, like just in Rome, just where our Catholic faith is rooted and.
And then to have that experience that Annie, like, because I really believe, you know, God had me be pregnant because I had to worry about the baby too. Like I couldn't travel away from Joe. There were just like all these things that the Lord had arranged to make things work and fall into the place the way that he, you know, he had in mind, which was more important than what I had in mind. Yeah. And so I guess that
you know, covers and now, know, Joe and I now we've moved to Tennessee and we have four children. So our fourth Leo came in Tennessee and, and yeah, he just continues to be so good. And I will say like through this process, like I also learned with the Lord, like there were so many times where I, you know, was trying to perform for God's love. Right. And he has really,
Just taught me like there's nothing that you can do like I'm always gonna love you so just like do you you know, like be the best you you can be but don't be trying to earn my love and And because of that I've received it so much more fully. So Yeah
Lindy Wynne (21:21.78)
Nicole, you are a treasure and you really just brought us on a journey from Good Friday to Easter Sunday. In your heart, in your soul, in your marriage, it's so deeply moving and there are so many threads in there that I wanna unpack. And one that you just talked about again, and I heard this quote once from someone about how the person started working from their imperfection.
rather than their perfection. And that's part of what I'm hearing in you is that as you learned to be honest and that you learned to be real and both within the concept of like yourself and working from yourself and looking at yourself as you are, both like sin and grace, like God's goodness, God's giftings, all your charism, all your beauty, and then also the ways that you struggle and you grapple.
and you sin like we all do, because we're all sinners. And so to hear you name that and to take responsibility in your own heart, you talked about having a heart of stone that became like scripture, a heart of flesh. That's really like so much at the heart of this, no pun intended here, is that that stony heart. It was so stony that when you went to church, you left because the responsorial Psalm was about that. And you're like, this is just
Nicole Berlucchi (22:45.389)
us.
Lindy Wynne (22:49.004)
too much for me right now, I'm not ready for this yet. God still sought you as God seeks us. And I'm so deeply moved by how when you were turning away essentially from Joe or taking pause and kind of moving away to get space to be able to look so deeply in yourself and at the reality of the situation, like look that and accept that as it was.
You still sought the Lord. Like you went into your car, you said, and you said like, come Holy Spirit. And then you also went to the priest. And then you also went to the Jersey Shore where you experienced God. It was interesting what came to me during that that I've never thought of really before for those of us who are called into the vocation of marriage. Like we long for intimacy with God.
with the Trinity, and then we long for intimacy with our spouse, and then we long for intimacy with other sisters in Christ. And you were missing that first one, yet you had and have great intimacy with God and with those girlfriends, those sisters in Christ. I was deeply moved by that. Like you called the woman that knew you and Joe the best who were invested in your marriage.
yet detached, like they respected that this was your discernment, that this is your relationship with God and they trusted you. They saw you as you are and love you as you are, so beautiful and they accompanied you in that authenticity. They loved you as you are. It sounds like they didn't try to fix anything. They didn't try to do anything other than just be with you and they love the Lord too. I mean, that is glorious, Nicole.
It's so glorious. And I started crying when you talked about how Father Phil called you and asked you to come back and that long table and you both sitting so symbolic. It's like, it's almost like Father Phil was inviting you to the Eucharistic table to encounter Christ yet at this like boardroom table like
Nicole Berlucchi (25:09.603)
Yes.
Lindy Wynne (25:10.347)
Cause your heart was actually like kind of there. It was more like mediation. It was part of the process and part of God cracking your heart open so deeply moving. It was part of the process. And that's the thing, we're working processes and so are our marriages and our hearts. And like I said in the beginning of this, someone listening might not be married. And if you are, your marriage is in
Any place or space that's not perfect because none of our marriages are perfect and so this speaks to to all of our heart and souls Because of that that heart of stone that became I believe it's an Ezekiel a heart of flesh So Nicole I would love for you to dig a little bit more into that first that Transformation of your heart if you could if you could really delve into what that experience was like for you
and how that helped to draw you in intimacy with Joe. And then I also want us to talk about like how you continue to hopefully by the grace of God nourish that now, because I love that you said you have four children now, because this is a story that continues to be written.
Nicole Berlucchi (26:25.251)
Yes, totally. So, yeah, so I would say, you know, when I went away, I really thought, God would think I was right. Right. And so that's I went into the weekend thinking that and, you know, he was going to be on my side, not on Joe's side. And as we as I, you know, continue to read, like I said,
through the weekend, both scripture and just some books. It was just revealed in such a way that I was never vulnerable. I was never vulnerable with Joe. I just was always, I always had the answer. I always had the task done. I can do it myself. You're not gonna put this swing together. I'll put the swing together myself. So it was just like.
I it was basically like what I was saying like when I was going to leave my husband I I'll be fine on my own I can handle this all myself was basically what I was saying in my marriage Which is not at all house a marriage is supposed to be you're supposed to want to do things But be constantly inviting your spouse into those vulnerable places, right? Like hey bad day at work. I need to decompress him. Can we talk? Can we go for a walk? You know like and so in doing that like
There was no, there was no room for Joe. And so it was a hard, it was hard to start to admit those vulnerable places. And I really believe, I mean, I think that's so beautiful. We say like the Eucharistic table. It was like a place where the Lord just gave me the opportunity to start that, you know, I was really able to just kind of lay out, you know, well, this, you know, this happens in our house and this is how, this is how it makes me feel. This happens in our house. This is how it makes me feel. just,
really and Joe responded to some of those things too. Like one of the things I did say was like, I don't think you were ready to get married. And he was able to say, I still remember he said back, he's like, he's like, I honestly can't say like, he's like, I can't say I was thinking I wasn't ready to get married, but I'm not sure that I was ready to get married. But he's like, that doesn't matter now. Like I want to be married to you now. And so yeah, so it was, it was, it was hard.
Nicole Berlucchi (28:52.951)
It was hard for me to be vulnerable. It still is. I would say that I'm very much still a work in progress, but I am learning. And that's, you know, not just in my marriage, but in friendships and just, you know, the general work, whatever, you know, kind of being able to admit, hey, I don't have this all on my own and I need your help or I need you praying for me or I need you with me. I need you to listen more. need you, I need your help in the kitchen, you know, like just.
things that I would refuse basically to ask Joe, like just to help me get ready, dinner ready. And then of course, know, we just, last weekend we had, the kids were kind of like all occupied. so Joe ended up, you know, steering up some tuna and was making dinner for me. And this would have never happened, you know, like.
in the first few years of our marriage and the state that it was. And so, and I said to him, I'm like, I just love, I love that we do this, like that we cook together and do the dishes together. And, and so, yeah, I feel like for me, it was really, it was really a tough place. And even with the Lord, I will say, I went through, so I do the word of the year, if you pray with the word of the year. And so one, one of the years my word was love, which seemed like such a,
was like, Lord, like this is the word you're giving me, And I started realizing that I really wasn't letting the Lord love me well, as well as he could. And so I just started with like a basic exercise of like just sitting quietly and then imagining him saying like, Nicole, I love you. Just over and over, Nicole, I love you.
and just taking in how his voice sounded and just letting that kind of wash over me. And it went from like being super cheesy. first I was like, Nicole, I love you, know, like this very, I equated to a scene in Home Alone when I describe it to friends. And so then it became this just like beautiful, tender, Nicole, I love you.
Lindy Wynne (30:46.186)
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Nicole Berlucchi (31:10.751)
And just being able to absorb that and take that into my heart was just, it was really life-changing. mean, from there, mean, my faith over the last, I would say like, you know, five years has really gone to the next level just because of how much I have learned to trust the Lord. And I guess I want to touch on, so one of the big things the Lord asked of me, and this is post, you know, everything.
This was probably, it was probably about five years after, things came to a head for us. the Lord asked me to quit my career and, he revealed that I was afraid to rely on Joe and that, still breaks my heart a little bit to say this, but that, I was, I had a backup plan.
If he left, I was ready. Like if he started acting the way he did, I was ready. I still had my career and I could leave him. And so when he convicted me of that, I...
I just couldn't deny it. It was just like, you're right, Lord. This is a backup plan. I'm ready for failure. And so I ended up going to jail and being like, listen, the Lord's telling me to quit my job. And I really feel like I have to do this. And I explained to him why I said it, because I'm afraid to rely on you financially. And...
Lindy Wynne (32:32.124)
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Nicole Berlucchi (32:52.099)
Joe was in shock. He wasn't exactly ready to give up my salary. But he was like, if this is something you really feel like you need to do, then let's just do it. And so I did, I left. I mean, it much the shock of my employer at the time. I left my job and, but again, God was so good. He,
Lindy Wynne (33:01.853)
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Nicole Berlucchi (33:17.475)
COVID hit soon after that, I was able to be totally present for my kids. We have so many incredible memories. And I started on this writing journey. So not starting writing the book, but just sharing my faith and really recognizing how the God works so many good things in my life when I just let him in and let him love me.
and make myself vulnerable.
Lindy Wynne (33:49.02)
I see it is so providential that behind you, I believe is that Proverbs four, God is within her, she will not fall. God is within you from that self reliance to that total dependency on God, which Father John Mayer and I really dig into in this Lenten series.
Nicole Berlucchi (33:55.255)
Yes.
Lindy Wynne (34:06.204)
Nicole, something came to me in the very beginning when you were sharing and that is that resentment is a thief. And I think that there are certain ways that we can behave like pridefulness that are really obvious. And I think resentfulness can be obvious, but it can also be like a quiet thief. Nicole, tell me if I'm wrong, but I think that like, the more we accept by the grace of God, how imperfect we are, the easier it is to accept our imperfection. And it's very freeing. Like it's a very, very beautiful thing to become more free in that. Like this is who, like this is who I am. And like I,
heal, I improve, I all the things by the grace of God. And speaking of renewing vows, Brian and I renewed our vows at 10 years. And I was very emotional because he'd been sick so many times in our first years of marriage and our first decade. And it was very, very difficult on many, levels. Then at the 20 year mark, he was emotional when we renewed our vows. And this year we are renewing our vows for our 25th wedding anniversary.
And so it is really moving and all that you have been sharing. And then when we talked about the Eucharistic table too, because Father Phil was sitting in the middle of you at the table and he's representing Christ. And it brings me back to when Brian and I made our wedding vows, we've talked about this many times before, because we both noticed this. When, after we set our vows, at some point, any of you who are married and had a Catholic mass, may remember this.
Lindy Wynne (36:29.423)
The priest took our hands and we knew this priest and he was always pretty lighthearted with us, but with a gravite, like a gravitas that he had never ever before or since used. He took our hands and said the scripture, what God has joined together, let no man divide. And what's coming to me, Nicole, from your sharing is, well, there's the sense of like,
no man divide like an external man or woman like infidelity or things of the sort. But it's like I got to look at myself like let no human divide, let no human including myself divide because I am am responsible for much division that has occurred in in my marriage like emotional division, spiritual division, you know all kinds of division because of me and because of the ways that I have behaved.
And because of things like resentment that I've held on to or unmet expectations that were just like my expectation. Like it's not God's will, it's not God's plan, it's not God's design, it's my own. And so you spoke so beautifully to that Nicole, because I love how you said, I thought God was on my side. It's like, but where was God, where is God symbolically? And literally when you were sitting at that table or when we're getting married, God's in the middle.
God is what binds and we're both in a marriage like you and Joe, Nicole and Joe, me and Brian, anybody else who's married. It's like God is what binds, God is in the middle and we're all God's beloved children and God's will is healing.
Nicole Berlucchi (38:14.551)
Yes. Amen.
Lindy Wynne (38:16.504)
And so you're so beautiful, Nicole. Thank you so much for sharing your story and your witness with us. And it is such a beautiful invitation. I hear a couple or a few invitations in here for us from this podcast and this mini retreat together. The first is the, love you, Nicole. I love you, Nicole. So for each one of us in our prayer today, this week,
ongoing in our lives to say to imagine Jesus in front of us imagine God in front of us Imagine our blessed mother in front of us wherever God's drawing you I Love you with your name. I love you and I love how you said Nicole that it was like kind of like jokey and uncomfortable at first and then over time and when you said it the last time it was so deeply moving because of the sincerity that sincerity of heart
and your receptiveness to that. And I think that embodies the scriptural passage about God making in us, like turning our hearts of stone into hearts of flesh in Ezekiel. Like that, that embodies that. So that's the first invitation. The second invitation is to let God humble us. just let ourselves be humbled. Whatever that means, like to see ourselves, to pray to see ourselves more as we are.
Nicole Berlucchi (39:36.419)
Thank
See you
Lindy Wynne (39:45.717)
and to focus on our own responsibility and things like how we are causing division in our marriages and friendship in our relationships with God. Like we are responsible and so often we don't look at that. Like it's so easy to point the finger outward instead of pointing it at ourselves. And so in this Lenten season and in life,
to really grow in our awareness and our understanding by the grace of God as of how we are each responsible, what's unfolding. And third, I would say if you are married and struggling in your marriage, which in some way everybody is, because we're human, is to seek help, seek resources, read Nicole's book. And Nicole, can you tell us where we can get your book and just like a little blurb about it?
Nicole Berlucchi (40:37.035)
Yeah, for sure. So, the book is available on amazon's probably the easiest way to get it fastest way You don't have to pay for shipping, but you can also order it from me directly on my website nicole burlucci.com and I sent a little print, that says magnify love and but you you have to pay for shipping so it's like, I don't know and then what was the other thing? just talk about the I I just talked about the spiritual warfare,
Lindy Wynne (41:00.876)
just a little bit about it.
Nicole Berlucchi (41:05.717)
involved with marriage. mean, Satan really, you you talked about division, Lindy, it's just, that's what he wants, right? He is like in our corner when we are turning away from our spouse, he wants us to turn as far away as possible and walk in the opposite direction. And I think people just need to be so super aware. And I really believe I mean, I didn't talk a lot about the rosary in this podcast, but
I prayed a daily rosary and I've done a lot of research recently on the power of the rosary and kind of what's the history there. And I really believe it was why I, was a big reason why I could let the Lord in and was in the mindset I was where I could listen to him that weekend away. And so I tell our story through the mysteries of the rosary and just, it's just to show you of how like, in that last part we say,
Lindy Wynne (41:53.721)
.
Nicole Berlucchi (41:59.539)
that we may imitate what they contain and obtain what they promise as it relates to the mysteries. And that's what really happened for me is like, you know, when I could take the cross and really believe in resurrection, that the Lord would bring it there and that in doing that, he ultimately led us to mission, you know, to the luminous mysteries which came later. I mean, not in Jesus's story, but later for us and and just what he what the Lord gives us and what he does for us. And so
You'll get my full story. You'll probably hear some of the stuff I talked about, but definitely much more from beginning to nearly present day today. And so I would be so grateful if you read it and are blessed by it. And I'm really, I really wrote it to serve, to serve the Lord and to help other people who, who are struggling in marriage, because I really felt like I couldn't find a book like that when I was going through it. It was like how to be the perfect spouse or
how to leave him basically where the two ends. And so this is kind of middle of the road, like having those feelings, but really wanting to heal your marriage. So yeah.
Lindy Wynne (43:06.839)
That's so beautiful, thank you, Nicole. And I realize I never followed through with you answering about like to today. So your book answers to today. And also what I'm hearing from you is that the rosary is your weapon. And I've also seen you at daily mass and adoration and all the things. And so you engage very fully in your life of faith and in your prayer life and the sacramental life. Yeah, praise God, praise God. So everybody knows Ezekiel 36, 26 is.
Nicole Berlucchi (43:27.116)
Absolutely.
Lindy Wynne (43:34.132)
the verse on, will give you a new heart and put a new Spirit within you. I will take the heart of stone out of your flesh and give you a heart of flesh. So beautiful scripture to pray with also for your marriage. If you're married, Matthew 19 six is that is the verse about. then they are no longer two, but one flesh. Therefore what God has joined together, let no man separate or no man divide. Nicole, you are a treasure. Thank you so much for being with us.
And everyone, just so you know, I held up Nicole's book on YouTube. I hope that you will subscribe to Momma's in Spirit and listen to these stories of souls, these beautiful stories of souls and God's transformative work. You can subscribe at Apple Podcasts, Spotify, YouTube, wherever you like to go to listen or to watch and reach out at any time at mammasinspirit.gmail.com or on social media, Instagram or Facebook are the best. And Father John and I, the chaplain, pray for you.
And also Nicole shared her website. She'll pray for you and she'll pray for your marriage. I know that I don't even have to ask her. I know she will. So if there's any way she can be supportive of you as well, please reach out to Nicole and Nicole in that Spirit. Can you close this in prayer?
Nicole Berlucchi (44:47.651)
In the name of the Father and of the Son and of Holy Spirit. Amen.
Jesus, we trust in you.
You are so good, the good shepherd, always leading us home. Help us to follow you, to walk in your ways, to listen to your mother who is always calling us to you.
Nicole Berlucchi (45:14.723)
Come Holy Spirit.
Open our hearts to whatever the Lord is trying to tell us, reveal to us in our lives.
We give all glory to God. Glory be to the Father and to the Son and to the Holy Spirit as it was in the beginning, is now and ever shall be, or well with that end. Amen. In the name of the Father and of the Son and the Holy Spirit. Amen.
Lindy Wynne (45:40.872)
Thank you so much, Nicole, and thank you for joining us.
Nicole Berlucchi (45:44.033)
Thank you so much for having me. So blessed by mamas in Spirit. And so I just really appreciate this ministry and all you do for women.
Lindy Wynne (45:51.914)
Well, I'm blessed to be a mom in Spirit with you. For those of you who don't know, the word mama came from my time at an orphanage in Mexico, and they would refer to the little girls as mama, and it delighted my heart, and I thought, this is how God looks at us. This is how God adores us as his beloved daughters, as his little mamas. So it's both symbolically about being a mother in Spirit, I'm an adoptive mother, but also about us being God's beloved daughters. So blessed to be one with you, Nicole, and with all of you.
There are seven podcasts part of this Lenten series. I hope that you will listen to either all of them or all of them that you sense God drawing you to. And ultimately, I pray that they help you to have those kind of moments that Nicole had when she went to the Jersey Shore, knowing that God is with you. God is with you, Emmanuel. No matter what you're facing in yourself, in your relationships, in your circumstances in life, you are not alone.
and God wants to transform you and all of our hearts. Can't wait to be together again next time. This is Lindy Wynne with Mamas in Spirit. May God bless you and yours always.